Re: Just wondering...

[Case Roole <cjr@xs4all.nl>]

Simon wrote:
> I know this list is called the "Appraising Microsoft" list, but from some
> of the participants - Mitch, who runs the boycott Microsoft site, Jamie,
> who spent a spell on the MSNBC Technology BBS trying to convince everyone
> that MS was up to no good, etc etc, I get the feeling that a more accurate
> name would be "Anti Microsoft".

Interesting. You designate the list not according to the contents of the
messages, but according to the additional activities of the list members. 
You could add me to the list of Mitch and Jamie in this sociological
approach, but I wonder if the other list members would make your "etc etc" 
true?

> So, to see if I'm wasting my time here (preaching to people who have
> already religiously made up their mind and know innately through some kind
> of divine intervention that Microsoft is Evil, Injust, Cruel to animals
> and generally downright rotten), if anyone here takes a pro-Microsoft or
> even a not-all-that-against Microsoft - or preferably a "Show me the
> facts" stance, can they let me know?

Simon, on what basis do you claim that I have "religiously made up my mind
and know innately through some kind of divine intervention that Microsoft
is Evil, Injust, Cruel to animals and generally downright rotten"?
Perhaps you should reflect on your own "Show me the facts" stance.

You could have simply asked how people on the list have come to their
present appraisal of Microsoft and draw your own conclusions. FYI, I never
cared a bit about Microsoft until reading Mr. Gates "The Road Ahead" and
found that his version of history isn't the one I lived through. Since 
then, October 1997, I gradually got more interested in Microsoft's 
*actions*, especially wrt public relations.  

 




> 
> I'm intrigued, because day in, day out, I read people on this list venting
> spleen about the evils of Microsoft, over analyzing everything down to the
> slightest minutae, and taking *anything* and *everything* as evidence of
> Microsoft's evildoing. Eg. the current posts about Office and Netscape,
> and previous posts about Microsoft running sweat shops with Russian
> Immigrant programmers.

This list is about appraising Microsoft and, indeed, most people here are 
eager to find fault with Microsoft. As is the way of building knowledge,
they set up tentative hypotheses to the effect that the event or action
in question shows Microsoft's bad intent. Many of such hypotheses are
falsified or not found sufficiently interesting to pursue. Aside from
pinpointing others to interesting news, this process of reasoning is 
what makes this list worth while. I'm sorry that you haven't noticed it.

> 
> Am I just misreading peoples intent here? Or is this just a place for
> everyone to get together and villify Microsoft? You know, your typical
> advocacy place, where even cold hard fact won't change peoples opinions?

On what basis do you say this, Simon? Consider this: if people here are
eager to vilify Microsoft, they could find more populous forums elsewhere.
Wouldn't that be more attractive to them? So, why are they here? 

By the way, it strikes me as odd that you see this list as a place where
"even cold hard fact won't change people's opinions" just after you claimed
that no pro-Microsoft statements (your "cold hard facts"?) are found here. 

> 
> Curious, no offence intended,

Simon, I appreciate your "no offence intended". However, quite frankly,
you were rather offensive. If you wanted to find out about me - as one
of those list members that you speak of in general terms - you could
have phrased your questions more respectfully. This would have resulted
in a more positive evaluation of the value of your past, present, and
future remarks than I will give now. 

> Simon (not speaking in any way for my employer, which is indeed Microsoft,
> and which may or may not share my views)
> 

Incidentally, I generally appreciate your postings. Your arguments are
often thought-provoking and as such I value them as means to improve my
own arguments. That is what "appraising" is all about for me.

-cjr