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Re: A bit of history, for those new to the anti-dioxin move



  Jon thanks for the reponse. As I think about my personal health history, I
  think about the asbestos wrapped pipes in the basement of our old house,
  my father as a four pack a day smoker, living in a polluted city near an
  auto paint shop and a field trip to Seveso a year before the diagnosis.
  Not a list that would make an epidemiologist clap her hands with the joy
  of indisputable correlation, but interesting none the less. 
  
  The immune system reponse is fascinating. I am still wondering what a
  histamine is. 
  Cheers
  
  
  Harriet Rosenberg
  Health and Society Programme
  Social Science Division (Arts)		 
  York University
  Note New E-Mail Address: hrosenbe@yorku.ca 
  			
  On Fri, 28 Nov 1997, Jon Campbell wrote:
  
  > Hi, Harriet,
  > 
  >        I'm gratified that you would quote me regarding the introduction of
  > plastics into industrial chemicals and products.
  > 
  >       There is a great deal of anecdotal evidence that something really
  > quite odd is going on with respect to asthma, diesel exhaust, incinerators,
  > and dioxin (or maybe other organochlorine by-product, but dioxin is the most
  > potent of them...). The dioxin air emissions from incinerators are primarily
  > carried clinging to microscopic and sub-microscopic particulates. Diesel
  > exhaust is also known to contain dioxin, and the pattern of dispersion is
  > likely to be the same. As you know, the incidence of asthma in cities in
  > general and incinerator cities specifically has skyrocketed, to the point
  > where 1/3 of the kids have asthma and many adults are developing it as well.
  > 
  > There are many possible scenarios, for instance:
  > 
  > 1. Dioxin interferes with the immune system. That much is known. The immune
  > system also has something to do with the Ah receptor, but the research is
  > sketchy. General immune system depression (to common colds and flu) is a
  > common symptom of dioxin exposure. It is also a common affliction of
  > "modern" allergy/asthma sufferers. Maybe there is a connection or
  > correlation there.
  > Whatever it is, breathing sub-microscopic particulates with dioxin molecules
  > clinging to them cannot be good for one's lungs.
  > 
  > 2. Dioxin causes dysplasia - the growth of a type of cells that don't belong
  > in the place where they are growing. (An example is endometriosis, for which
  > dioxin is a known cause and, I believe, the only known cause). I have heard
  > of stomach acid cells growing on the lining of the esophagus.
  > At least one researcher has found a correlation between stomach acid
  > irritation and asthma. Another possible avenue of research.
  >       In the city, asbestos is also a factor. Its irritative potential is
  > magnified by orders of magnitude when there are also aromatic hydrocarbons.
  > 
  > I hope this helps...
  > 
  > Jon
  > 
  > -----Original Message-----
  > From: Harriet Rosenberg <hrosenbe@yorku.ca>
  > To: Jon Campbell <jon@cqs.com>
  > Cc: Multiple recipients of list <dioxin-l@essential.org>
  > Date: Thursday, November 27, 1997 4:16 PM
  > Subject: Re: A bit of history, for those new to the anti-dioxin move
  > 
  > 
  > >I am joining a discussion on asthma and dioxin which may have long since
  > >petered out.But I am very interested for personal reasons.
  > >
  > >My academic and political interest for many years has been in
  > >social and political struggles of women in toxic politics. 9 months ago, i
  > >was diagnosed as having asthma. living in polluted downtown Toronto and
  > >having a mother who had adult onset asthma, I thought I knew pretty much
  > >why i contracted this horrible disease. But in reading more about it, I
  > >agree with whoever wrote about it not just being a problem of respiration
  > >of bronchial irritants. Jon Campell's discussion of the industrial
  > >revolution  makes sense to me. It would make  sense
  > >that introducing plastics incineration into the picture would alter the
  > >situation.
  > >
  > >If dioxins and furans act as endocrine system hormones, might they not
  > >also disrupt other hormones in the body? My understanding is that the body
  > >reads certain triggers as dangerous and sends out a lot of histamines,
  > >which
  > >create a lot of thick mucous in the lungs which restricts breathing. How
  > >does this reading occur? Could it be affected by dioxins/furans as ah
  > >receptors are affected?
  > > What  are histamines? An article on asthma epidemic in Time said they
  > >were hormones. My doctor says not.
  > >
  > >The conventional treatment to control asthma is inhaled corticosteroids
  > >which work to depress the immune system and to prevent the "over-reaction
  > >response " which stops the over-production of histamines. I think...
  > >
  > >Actually the literature on asthma is confusing. There is another  body of
  > >lit that connects it to underproduction of CO2 in the lungs as well as the
  > >discussion already cited about the inspiration of various pollutants which
  > >act to mechanically irritate the lungs.
  > >
  > >Any further thoughts anyone?
  > >
  > >Harriet Rosenberg
  > >Health and Society Programme
  > >Social Science Division (Arts)
  > >York University
  > >Note New E-Mail Address: hrosenbe@yorku.ca
  > >
  > >On Sun, 10 Aug 1997, Jon Campbell wrote:
  > >
  > >>  Hi,
  > >>
  > >> Those are precisely my thoughts on the subject. I have
  > >> been thinking
  > >> about the fact that, in the early part of the
  > >> Industrial Revolution, when
  > >> London, New York, Liverpool, and other early industrial
  > >> cities were
  > >> thick with smoke, the amount of bronchial asthma in the
  > >> population
  > >> was still very, very small. Lots of emphysema, lots of
  > >> lung cancer,
  > >> but few reports of asthma, whose symptoms are very
  > >> specific
  > >> (not chronic lung insufficiency, but acute
  > >> sensitivity). There were
  > >> also lots of incinerators - one in virtually every
  > >> apartment building -
  > >> burning everything imaginable (but NOT organochlorine
  > >> plastics,
  > >> because there weren't any!) SOMETHING
  > >> in "modern" smoke is interfering in some way with the
  > >> bronchial
  > >> immune response. Again, this is a complete surmise, a
  > >> total
  > >> guess, that organochlorines (not even necessarily TCDD)
  > >> might be involved. Of course, Sam and Alex, you might
  > >> be
  > >> right about heavy metals. Those were also absent in
  > >> turn-of-the-century
  > >> smoke. ...
  > >>
  > >> By the way: to Sam and Alex:
  > >>  I hope you two didn't take my disagreement
  > >> with you about GP sampling the wrong way. I have a
  > >> great
  > >> deal of respect for your contributions both to this
  > >> mail-list
  > >> and also to the environmental movement in general. I
  > >> just
  > >> disagree about whether extraordinary (read: illegal)
  > >> means
  > >> are occasionally justified. And we needn't beat the
  > >> stuffed
  > >> horse about it more...
  > >>
  > >> Thanks,
  > >> Jon
  > >>
  > >>
  > >> -----Original Message-----
  > >> From: Rebecca Leighton Katers <cwac@execpc.com>
  > >> To: Multiple recipients of list
  > >> <dioxin-l@essential.org>
  > >> Date: Saturday, August 09, 1997 7:45 PM
  > >> Subject: Re: A bit of history, for those new to the
  > >> anti-dioxin move
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >> Regarding the question of a possible dioxin and asthma
  > >> link:
  > >>
  > >> My understanding is that asthma is more than just
  > >> a response to air pollutants entering the lungs.
  > >> It's the result of an immune system malfunction.
  > >>
  > >> While evidence of a direct breathing response to
  > >> dioxin may not be in the literature --- dioxin
  > >> and other chlorinated organics are suspected of
  > >> damaging the immune system.
  > >>
  > >> Isn't it possible that dioxin's damage to the immune
  > >> system is making people more vulnerable to
  > >> developing an asthma response to other
  > >> pollutants?
  > >>
  > >>
  > >>
  > >> Rebecca Leighton Katers
  > >> Clean Water Action Council of N.E. Wisconsin
  > >> 2220 Deckner Avenue
  > >> Green Bay, WI 54302
  > >> Phone:  414-468-4243
  > >> Fax:  414-468-1234
  > >> E-mail:  cwac@execpc.com
  > >>
  > >>
  > >
  > >
  >