[Am-info] QUESTION - Should this list go away?

[Gene Gaines]

John,

Your response to my political statement (below inline)
is EXCELLENT.

It comment it to everyone on the AM-INFO list for careful
reading.

Do we disagree?  Am I offended by your statments?  Heck no.

We share the same objectives, and are merely having a
discussion about steps along the road in attempting to
keep our country's great experiment alive and thriving,
and make the world a better place for everyone.

Thank you!  Good food for thought!

Gene
gene.gaines@gainesgroup.com

On Wednesday, June 23, 2004, 11:53:16 AM, John wrote:

> Gene Gaines wrote:

>>Why do I think this?  What are my political leanings?
>>

> Thanks for your opinion.  I, too am registered independent. But I am
> 180 degrees from you in my opinion of President Bush.  I'll challenge
> your statements one-by-one.

>>
>>I am an Independent. But my passion is getting rid of the Bush
>>administration. In less than four years, they have reduced our
>>country from a position of pride on the global scene to one of
>>the world deeply resenting us as bullies, 
>>
> By "the world" I take it you mean people like the French, Germans,
> Russians and most of the UN?  I suppose you are aware of the "Oil for
> Food" scandal, where leaders of the above institutions took millions in
> bribes from Saddam Hussein.  They kept him in power, kept his people in
> starving and impoverished conditions, supplying outdated and useless
> medicines to sick Iraqi children, while they pocketed a share of
> Saddam's oil billions.  Saddam, meanwhile, continued to *invest* in
> opulent palaces for himself and his cronies, as well as weapons.

> By "resenting us as bullies" I take it you mean the roughly 12.5 million
> Afghan women and girls who are now free to participate in things like
> education, politics, business, etc. ? Such women were bullied hideously
> by the former government of Afghanistan.  They are now free.

> And the very same holds for the women of Iraq.  And the men of Iraq are
> now free to seek their own paths in life without fear of torture - I
> mean real torture, like getting one's tounge sliced off with a razor, or
> having one's hands amputated, or watching one's children being
> tortured.  Given my choice, I'd prefer to have women's underwear on my
> head than any of Saddam's tender mercies. 

> Have you seen the video of the seven Iraqi businessmen who had their
> right hands amputated by Saddam's thugs?  The hands werre replaced with
> prosthetics and the seven men are now returning to Iraq.  They get
> teary-eyed when they can now clasp the hands of their children and
> families with new hands supplied by American surgeons.  Wouldn't have
> happened without Bush's actions.

> Of course you haven't seen the video.  The major news outlets have
> buried this story just like they bury all good things that come as a
> result of Bush's decisions.

> There *was* an Iraqi nuclear program.  It was in Libya.  Iraqi
> scientists, about 800 of them, were working in Khadaffi's underground
> laboratory using North Korean materials to make atomic bombs, which they
> would gladly have used to threaten us, as well as France, Germany,
> Russia and most of the UN.  Thanks to Bush, that threat is now eliminated.

> There *were* Iraqi chemical and biological weapons.  Just before the
> war, they were shipped out of the country, much to Syria, where Zarqawi,
> an Al-Quaida operative in Baghdad planned to use them to kill 80,000
> people in Jordan.  Thank God that attack was foiled.

> Bush liberated at least 50,000,000 people.  He also saved your ass and
> mine from the terror threats posed by Saddam and his ilk.

> George Bush has withstood the vicious lies and assaults from the Press
> and media in the US and most of the world.  These media have misled
> everybody because they don't like a person with the moral clarity of
> Pres. Bush.

>>have through dishonest
>>pork-barrel politics run up the largest deficits and federal
>>debt in our history, 
>>

> Bull.  The deficit is a smaller share of GDP than in any previous war
> time.  And the economic growth spurred by Bush's tax cuts is reducing
> both the Federal and most State deficits.  Even Social Security was
> recently reported to be closer to solvency than it was before Bush.

>>and their playing politics have reduced our
>>best federal agencies from reasonable effectiveness to a
>>playground for contractors to reap profits. 
>>
> I take it you mean Halliburton?  Halliburton is the only company with
> the experience, equipment and expertise necessary to manage the complex
> needs of restoring Iraqi oil industry.  There was no time to offer
> "lowest bidder" deals to companies who just can't match Halliburton's
> capabilities.  And by the way, Cheney has absolutely no investment nor
> involvement with Halliburton.

> Or maybe you meant Enron?  Enron's skulduggery was mostly done while
> Clinton was in power.

> Or maybe you mean gentlemen like George Soros, who recommends drug
> legalization, Euthanasia, overthrowing governments he doesn't agree
> with, like Georgia, and who gives millions of dollars to the Democrats
> (so-called champions of the poor and downtrodden little folks) just to
> defeat George Bush?  Remember the Democrats pushing "Campaign Finance
> Reform?"  They reformed so much, they are more than happy to take Soros'
> dirty millions.

> Or maybe you meant people like Mark Rich, a convicted arms smuggler and
> black-market operator, as well as massive tax evader, who was also in on
> the Oil-for-food take, and who gave large sums of money to Clinton, who
> pardoned him?

>>Disgusting. (No, not
>>every person in the present administration is bad, and not all
>>federal agencies are bad, but the closer one gets to the
>>ideologues in the White House, the steeper one finds the slide
>>into dishonesty and chaos.
>>  
>>

> You can't name a single instance of dishonesty.  Almost everything Bush
> said has turned out to be true.  The few remaining issues will turn out
> to be true in a few months.  Just keep your eyes on the Oil-for-food thing.

> Bush will be re-elected.  Maybe by a landside.  Nader will not be a factor.

> John


>>My opinion. You asked. I responded. I will not air my personal
>>politics on this list again. Everyone deserves a fair hearing
>>and civil treatment, but not in Washington DC at this moment.
>>
>>  
>>


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